1. Reflecting on the structure of strategy lessons provided on p. 99, what similarities (and perhaps differences) do you see between this structure, the architecture of a workshop minilesson, and the architecture of a 1-on-1 conference. You may also choose to speak to your personal experiences when providing predictable structures for student learning.
The structure of strategy lessons and the architecture of the reading workshop work together in creating predictable structures for student learning. Compliment and connections are important during whole group, or small groups, the children are reminded where they were and where they will be going on their literary journey. How I will present the instruction will be in my lesson and it will be brief. Checking that the engaging component has a right fit for the independent portion. The linking portion is applying the strategy of the day in various independent activities throughtout the day. Margaret Fox Chapter 4 from Bobbi Friend #1 – Using a predictable structure for teaching is very important for students. I see the structure of a strategy lesson as very similar to the structure of the whole group mini-lesson. Beginning with a connection and compliment is the same way we begin a mini-lesson in reading workshop. We always need to remind students what we did the day before or in the past and tell students what we have seen them using. The teach step is the heart and soul of a strategy lesson, whether it be in a whole group setting or in a small group. The engage step is how we coach students into how to use their new strategy and have them practice the strategy. The link step is how we then teach students how to apply their new knowledge to every situation. I think that the more often we can teach using a structure that is predictable and repeated throughout the day, the better our students will learn and retain what they have been taught. Predictable structure is consistent delivery of what we want to teach. It leads towards consistent expectations and accountability for ourselves and our students. This structure looks like many of the ways I learned to teach, just different words. The structure is good teaching psychology. Connect and compliment focuses the lesson for the students, and puts them in a positive frame of thought by building or reinforcing the strong parts of their reading. Teach: is really a form of modeling. I like best the reminder to keep it short and explicit to the skills we are teaching. I find myself many times wanting to spend too much time on modeling. Maybe it is because while I'm modeling I'm still in control and not prepared yet for them to engage or practice on their own. Engage is really where I find out if what I taught is making sense for my students. It may mean a homerun where I have minimal follow-up work or a strike out where I have to go back and start from the beginning again. I like the idea of keeping them working independently and practicing these new skills and strategies until I coach them individually. I can linger during this time if need be or move on quickly. Link is like a reinforcing piece. Keep at it, keep trying, AND we will revisit to see how it goes. It leaves the door open for more teaching if need be or just a quick check in and "Hey, you do this well, please keep it up!" Bobbi really summed it up well " I THINK THE MORE OFTEN WE CAN TEACH USING STRUCTURE THAT IS PREDICTABLE AND REPEATED THROUGHOUT THE DAY, THE BETTER OUR STUDENTS WILL LEARN AND RETAIN WHAT THEY HAVE BEEN TAUGHT". Mike
I think that strategy lessons, workshop mini lessons and 1 to 1 conferences all are similar in that they should follow a predictable structure of connect and compliment, teach, engage and link. I think that you should let the child know why you are pulling them in a small group or talking to them one on one. Then you demonstrate procedure to help them accomplish the goal that we stated. They then need to have an opportunity to practice it while you monitor and coach them. This stage is the hardest step for me as I find myself not setting a good pace of movement among students and with my first grade students some are very "teacher time" needy. It is harder for me to move them to the "you do it" phase and just "support" them so they don't struggle. I know I need to become stronger in this area. I don't "coach mindfully" and need to become better are reading the children's signals. This would help me to be more time efficient. It is a good idea to restate the purpose and make sure you encourage them to continue practicing the skill on their own. This is like a grand send off with a reminder of how great they were doing and what it was again they were going to practice. We all could use this step in our daily lives. Ronda
I think that the structure explained in chapter 4 is a great model...I haven't taught in the Reader's Workshop but I have had the opportunity to observe my teachers at work during this block of their day. I think the teach part comes very easily to almost any teacher but I think it is easy for us to forget the connect and compliment part...we just want to jump into our lessons...we have the learning mapped out in our brains but if we included our students in the plan...they would actually help us keep our focus through out the lesson. I think this model is just plain "good teaching". As an administrator, I have struggled with the connect and compliment section when I am working with my staff. When I remember to do this, they are more engaged and more focused because they know my target and they are picking out the important learning points to help meet the target as we go. Whenever I am going to learn something new, I always want to know the connection to me first and then the learning comes easily. Carol Dawson
I agree with Carol. The three share a similar structure. The predictability is comfortable for my students. I have used the structure in reading workshop but not with individual students or small groups. I don't know why it never occured to me. I am so excited to be adding this to my teaching. I know that as I incorporate the connect, teach, engage,and link structure I will get immediate feedback and know who need additional support. I like the idea of the strategy lesson in a small group setting. I have use this format with individuals only. I have the information on my students strengths and weaknesses through assessments and putting together groups for strategy lessons will be quick. Deb McLeod
The size of the group is mainly the main difference. Page 99 lays out the strategy lesson structured format. It is easy to remember and easy to follow. It makes doing both the mini lesson and the conference more seamless since they are so similar. Kdn
2. When reading that demonstrations show the “declarative, procedural and conditional knowledge needed for learning” I stopped to reread. These three made a lot of sense to me. I appreciated how the author defined these three essentials and I connected the “procedural” knowledge to my current experiences learning how to provide a step-by-step approach to strategy teaching.
What did you notice about effective demonstrations (starting on p. 114) that is similar to what you already do or are (like me) just learning to do when demonstrating? What new piece(s) might you add?
Effective Demonstrations are, to me, role playing. I am giving my students a visual and audio of a new strategy or one that needed to be re taught. The bullits on 114-15 will be my points I will cover during the demonstration. I have set the children up with a clear and concise vision of what to practice in their groups. I do demonstrations in areas of math and science. I think in reading I was a modeler. Just another ajustment for my instructive mode. Margaret Fox
Chapter 4 from Bobbi Friend #2 – In order to use effective demonstrations in our classroom teaching, we need to practice this teaching strategy. As a teacher, I find it easy to tell the students what I want them to know, model it for them, have them practice it with my help, and then have them practice it on their own. The biggest difference between this and an effective demonstration is the process of allowing students to understand the strategy by making it visible so that it doesn’t look like the reader achieved the goal/skill through an act of divine intervention. The demonstration needs to show the declarative, procedural, and conditional knowledge needed for learning. When using the effective demonstration, children are able to learn and watch, and they are able to see you struggle with the strategy so that they can see and understand how to apply the strategy to fix what is going wrong. This type of teaching gives students a clear vision for what to practice, not just something that has been told to them. I am going to have to practice using this type of teaching in order to do it well.
I liked reading the section on Effective Demonstrations on page 114. This is a model I actually use in my classroom--I usually tend to use this more often in a math lesson though. The kids love to watch me make mistakes. It keeps them engaged and shows them that everyone makes mistakes and gives them the steps to work through any difficulties. Since I am new to reader's workshop I haven't done this with reading mini-lessons but I can definately see its benefits. I like the idea of instantly having the kids practice while I am available to coach them. Jennifer's plate spinning story was great and really gave me the perspective of effective demonstration. Like anything new--I would hope to have someone helping and coaching me along, it is very reassuring to know someone is there to help you along- like having a safety net. --Jodee Tuttle
Like Jodee, I also love the part where the author says, "One time, she even made a mistake on purpose--wiggling the stick back and forth in a way that would not yield a plate in the air--to show us a common error we might make. It didn't end there, however; she demonstrated how to fix the problem." Wow! This was a big ah-ha for me. I think we have all done the writing lesson or reading lesson where we make a mistake on purpose to show kids that it is okay to make a mistake...we are human...mistakes are okay...our classroom is a safe learning environment--but, I have never really considered that that is only 1/2 of the picture. It makes so much sense to demonstrate common errors and even more sense to show kids how to fix the error! I love this! If we are diliberately teaching kids how to correct common errors, we are setting them up for even great success. Smart! Carol Dawson
This was a very interesting chapter. I found a lot of what I currently do and some new ideas I want to try. I have opened my eyes to the use of explicitly stating a strategy in any lesson to draw my students into the learning. I wonder how many times and how many students are sat at their table and wondered what I was doing and why! That is so powerful to me. I am going to weave this common thread throughout the curriculum. My students will see what the focus of a lesson is and be able to get their minds ready to take in the new information. I also let the kids catch me making a mistake. This helps them understand that mistakes are part of learning and makes them active learners. Deb McLeod
3. The chart on p. 118 provides clear examples of gradually releasing responsibility in our prompts we use with readers. I especially appreciated the ideas for very lean prompts, such as simply pointing to a signal word or phrase to encourage student response. That non-verbal level of leanness is rare for me. What about you? What is your experience with scaffolded supports? Did this chart, or the surrounding section (p. 116 –>on) provide any new thoughts for you as you work to provide just-right support for your readers?
This is my first exposure to gradual release ideas, and I think it will be especially helpful for me at 5th grade. I know with my 3rd graders that many times when going over a strategy I could see their eyes glaze over with that " I know how to do that" or "I don't need the FULL explanation again!" looks. The non-verbal signals is really a way to re-focus the reader to the strategy and it lets them know that you expect them to use the strategy and you expect that they will be successful. The chart on P. 118 , gives very good, explicit ideas to try. It fits right in with the hard, medium, and lean levels of support that are reinforced in this chapter. I'll be glad when I'm ready for that lean level of support! Mike
I think with first graders I tend to have a hard time being flexible with prompts. The stronger readers I tend to use more lean prompts and don't meet with them as much as I should. Once I realize they are stronger in an area, I focus more on the students that need more support to a fault sometimes. I could offer the stronger children other experiences with the same strategy in other books which would help them to become more proficient readers. I know after reading about releasing scaffolding over time and moving towards leaner prompts I don't always do this. I know I focus on these struggling students with very supportive prompts and help them every step of the way. I feel that I don't do a good job of handing off the baton to these children and don't move them towards independence as quickly as I should. I realize what I need to work on. Ronda
I work the same way as Ronda. My strong readers are often left to themselves because I focus on those who are struggling. I can see how small group strategy lessons can help both types of readers. .I need to find ways to support my strong readers to keep them moving forward. Using gradual release with this group should be easy. Letting the struggling readers go off on their own is hard. Those readers seem to be more dependent and less likely to use strategies to help them. I want to use small group lessons to give my struggling readers more support.( I can us the connect, teach, engage, and link.) . I want to make sure all of my students are moving toward being independent readers. Deb McLeod
With many of my students needing extensive support with phonics skills to help improve their reading, I've had the opportunity to be mentored by a master of scaffolding! I've watched her, in one lesson, go from extensive explanations to phrases, to words, and then non-verbal prompts to help a child decode an unfamiliar word. Because of her mentoring, I feel I am good at scaffolding strategies for decoding. I also feel comfortable with my ability to use lean prompts to help a child develop fluency. I always have a pencil following the text the reader is reading aloud, and I use it to tap, slide, or somehow motion what I want the reader to do or notice to support them with becoming a fluent reader. However, when it comes to other reading strategies, I find myself repeating the same lengthy explanation. I therefore provide too much support and need to work on making my language leaner, as Erin said. The chart on 118 gave me a clear picture of how I can scaffold language to support other reading strategies. It has provoked some self-reflection on the language I use, and I will be more aware of it as I teach this fall. ~Stephanie Benedict
I like being able to see and use the leaner prompts on page 118. I generally pare down my prompt on all subjects but I can feel guilt about that. Why? Not teaching enough? So it is so nice to have in black and white permission. Plus several ideas about how to accomplish this task and find success. The mini lesson tie also a teacher could scaffold student by giving a lean prompt dismiss those that are ready, give another meatier prompt to the group then dismiss another group and finally give a very supportive prompt to those that still need assistance.KDN
In addition to the questions and thoughts above, here is a place to post our other ideas and burning questions from chapter four, if any...
After reading this chapter, which really got me thinking of the release support. I tend to over-do the support. I especially liked the key ideas about coaching on page 108 combined with the gradual release of responsibity chart on page 118. I really need to study the leanes less supportive prompts because as I said I tend to give too much support which is probably delaying the students becoming independent which of course is my goal. I plan to make a copy of the strategies on page 118 and keep in with me as I confer and work with small groups to help me decide on a level of support needed. --Jodee Tuttle
I am very similar to Jodee in the area of over-doing support. In working with at-risk students, I find that they have tendencies to depend too much on the teacher. Some have also developed what some authors refer to as "self-helplessness". I find, like Jodee, I really have to monitor my teaching to make sure that I am going through that gradual release of responsiblity during my lessons. I think her idea of having the strategies on page 118 with me during my lessons will help support me with that challenge. Thanks for the great idea, Jodee! ~ Stephanie Benedict
1. Reflecting on the structure of strategy lessons provided on p. 99, what similarities (and perhaps differences) do you see between this structure, the architecture of a workshop minilesson, and the architecture of a 1-on-1 conference. You may also choose to speak to your personal experiences when providing predictable structures for student learning.
The structure of strategy lessons and the architecture of the reading workshop work together in creating predictable structures for student learning. Compliment and connections are important during whole group, or small groups, the children are reminded where they were and where they will be going on their literary journey. How I will present the instruction will be in my lesson and it will be brief. Checking that the engaging component has a right fit for the independent portion. The linking portion is applying the strategy of the day in various independent activities throughtout the day.Margaret Fox
Chapter 4 from Bobbi Friend #1 – Using a predictable structure for teaching is very important for students. I see the structure of a strategy lesson as very similar to the structure of the whole group mini-lesson. Beginning with a connection and compliment is the same way we begin a mini-lesson in reading workshop. We always need to remind students what we did the day before or in the past and tell students what we have seen them using. The teach step is the heart and soul of a strategy lesson, whether it be in a whole group setting or in a small group. The engage step is how we coach students into how to use their new strategy and have them practice the strategy. The link step is how we then teach students how to apply their new knowledge to every situation. I think that the more often we can teach using a structure that is predictable and repeated throughout the day, the better our students will learn and retain what they have been taught.
Predictable structure is consistent delivery of what we want to teach. It leads towards consistent expectations and accountability for ourselves and our students. This structure looks like many of the ways I learned to teach, just different words. The structure is good teaching psychology. Connect and compliment focuses the lesson for the students, and puts them in a positive frame of thought by building or reinforcing the strong parts of their reading. Teach: is really a form of modeling. I like best the reminder to keep it short and explicit to the skills we are teaching. I find myself many times wanting to spend too much time on modeling. Maybe it is because while I'm modeling I'm still in control and not prepared yet for them to engage or practice on their own. Engage is really where I find out if what I taught is making sense for my students. It may mean a homerun where I have minimal follow-up work or a strike out where I have to go back and start from the beginning again. I like the idea of keeping them working independently and practicing these new skills and strategies until I coach them individually. I can linger during this time if need be or move on quickly. Link is like a reinforcing piece. Keep at it, keep trying, AND we will revisit to see how it goes. It leaves the door open for more teaching if need be or just a quick check in and "Hey, you do this well, please keep it up!" Bobbi really summed it up well " I THINK THE MORE OFTEN WE CAN TEACH USING STRUCTURE THAT IS PREDICTABLE AND REPEATED THROUGHOUT THE DAY, THE BETTER OUR STUDENTS WILL LEARN AND RETAIN WHAT THEY HAVE BEEN TAUGHT".
Mike
I think that strategy lessons, workshop mini lessons and 1 to 1 conferences all are similar in that they should follow a predictable structure of connect and compliment, teach, engage and link. I think that you should let the child know why you are pulling them in a small group or talking to them one on one. Then you demonstrate procedure to help them accomplish the goal that we stated. They then need to have an opportunity to practice it while you monitor and coach them. This stage is the hardest step for me as I find myself not setting a good pace of movement among students and with my first grade students some are very "teacher time" needy. It is harder for me to move them to the "you do it" phase and just "support" them so they don't struggle. I know I need to become stronger in this area. I don't "coach mindfully" and need to become better are reading the children's signals. This would help me to be more time efficient. It is a good idea to restate the purpose and make sure you encourage them to continue practicing the skill on their own. This is like a grand send off with a reminder of how great they were doing and what it was again they were going to practice. We all could use this step in our daily lives. Ronda
I think that the structure explained in chapter 4 is a great model...I haven't taught in the Reader's Workshop but I have had the opportunity to observe my teachers at work during this block of their day. I think the teach part comes very easily to almost any teacher but I think it is easy for us to forget the connect and compliment part...we just want to jump into our lessons...we have the learning mapped out in our brains but if we included our students in the plan...they would actually help us keep our focus through out the lesson. I think this model is just plain "good teaching". As an administrator, I have struggled with the connect and compliment section when I am working with my staff. When I remember to do this, they are more engaged and more focused because they know my target and they are picking out the important learning points to help meet the target as we go. Whenever I am going to learn something new, I always want to know the connection to me first and then the learning comes easily. Carol Dawson
I agree with Carol. The three share a similar structure. The predictability is comfortable for my students. I have used the structure in reading workshop but not with individual students or small groups. I don't know why it never occured to me. I am so excited to be adding this to my teaching. I know that as I incorporate the connect, teach, engage,and link structure I will get immediate feedback and know who need additional support. I like the idea of the strategy lesson in a small group setting. I have use this format with individuals only. I have the information on my students strengths and weaknesses through assessments and putting together groups for strategy lessons will be quick. Deb McLeod
The size of the group is mainly the main difference. Page 99 lays out the strategy lesson structured format. It is easy to remember and easy to follow. It makes doing both the mini lesson and the conference more seamless since they are so similar. Kdn
2. When reading that demonstrations show the “declarative, procedural and conditional knowledge needed for learning” I stopped to reread. These three made a lot of sense to me. I appreciated how the author defined these three essentials and I connected the “procedural” knowledge to my current experiences learning how to provide a step-by-step approach to strategy teaching.
What did you notice about effective demonstrations (starting on p. 114) that is similar to what you already do or are (like me) just learning to do when demonstrating? What new piece(s) might you add?
Effective Demonstrations are, to me, role playing. I am giving my students a visual and audio of a new strategy or one that needed to be re taught. The bullits on 114-15 will be my points I will cover during the demonstration. I have set the children up with a clear and concise vision of what to practice in their groups. I do demonstrations in areas of math and science. I think in reading I was a modeler. Just another ajustment for my instructive mode.Margaret Fox
Chapter 4 from Bobbi Friend #2 – In order to use effective demonstrations in our classroom teaching, we need to practice this teaching strategy. As a teacher, I find it easy to tell the students what I want them to know, model it for them, have them practice it with my help, and then have them practice it on their own. The biggest difference between this and an effective demonstration is the process of allowing students to understand the strategy by making it visible so that it doesn’t look like the reader achieved the goal/skill through an act of divine intervention. The demonstration needs to show the declarative, procedural, and conditional knowledge needed for learning. When using the effective demonstration, children are able to learn and watch, and they are able to see you struggle with the strategy so that they can see and understand how to apply the strategy to fix what is going wrong. This type of teaching gives students a clear vision for what to practice, not just something that has been told to them. I am going to have to practice using this type of teaching in order to do it well.I liked reading the section on Effective Demonstrations on page 114. This is a model I actually use in my classroom--I usually tend to use this more often in a math lesson though. The kids love to watch me make mistakes. It keeps them engaged and shows them that everyone makes mistakes and gives them the steps to work through any difficulties. Since I am new to reader's workshop I haven't done this with reading mini-lessons but I can definately see its benefits. I like the idea of instantly having the kids practice while I am available to coach them. Jennifer's plate spinning story was great and really gave me the perspective of effective demonstration. Like anything new--I would hope to have someone helping and coaching me along, it is very reassuring to know someone is there to help you along- like having a safety net. --Jodee Tuttle
Like Jodee, I also love the part where the author says, "One time, she even made a mistake on purpose--wiggling the stick back and forth in a way that would not yield a plate in the air--to show us a common error we might make. It didn't end there, however; she demonstrated how to fix the problem." Wow! This was a big ah-ha for me. I think we have all done the writing lesson or reading lesson where we make a mistake on purpose to show kids that it is okay to make a mistake...we are human...mistakes are okay...our classroom is a safe learning environment--but, I have never really considered that that is only 1/2 of the picture. It makes so much sense to demonstrate common errors and even more sense to show kids how to fix the error! I love this! If we are diliberately teaching kids how to correct common errors, we are setting them up for even great success. Smart! Carol Dawson
This was a very interesting chapter. I found a lot of what I currently do and some new ideas I want to try. I have opened my eyes to the use of explicitly stating a strategy in any lesson to draw my students into the learning. I wonder how many times and how many students are sat at their table and wondered what I was doing and why! That is so powerful to me. I am going to weave this common thread throughout the curriculum. My students will see what the focus of a lesson is and be able to get their minds ready to take in the new information. I also let the kids catch me making a mistake. This helps them understand that mistakes are part of learning and makes them active learners. Deb McLeod
3. The chart on p. 118 provides clear examples of gradually releasing responsibility in our prompts we use with readers. I especially appreciated the ideas for very lean prompts, such as simply pointing to a signal word or phrase to encourage student response. That non-verbal level of leanness is rare for me. What about you? What is your experience with scaffolded supports? Did this chart, or the surrounding section (p. 116 –>on) provide any new thoughts for you as you work to provide just-right support for your readers?
This is my first exposure to gradual release ideas, and I think it will be especially helpful for me at 5th grade. I know with my 3rd graders that many times when going over a strategy I could see their eyes glaze over with that " I know how to do that" or "I don't need the FULL explanation again!" looks. The non-verbal signals is really a way to re-focus the reader to the strategy and it lets them know that you expect them to use the strategy and you expect that they will be successful. The chart on P. 118 , gives very good, explicit ideas to try. It fits right in with the hard, medium, and lean levels of support that are reinforced in this chapter. I'll be glad when I'm ready for that lean level of support!Mike
I think with first graders I tend to have a hard time being flexible with prompts. The stronger readers I tend to use more lean prompts and don't meet with them as much as I should. Once I realize they are stronger in an area, I focus more on the students that need more support to a fault sometimes. I could offer the stronger children other experiences with the same strategy in other books which would help them to become more proficient readers. I know after reading about releasing scaffolding over time and moving towards leaner prompts I don't always do this. I know I focus on these struggling students with very supportive prompts and help them every step of the way. I feel that I don't do a good job of handing off the baton to these children and don't move them towards independence as quickly as I should. I realize what I need to work on. Ronda
I work the same way as Ronda. My strong readers are often left to themselves because I focus on those who are struggling. I can see how small group strategy lessons can help both types of readers. .I need to find ways to support my strong readers to keep them moving forward. Using gradual release with this group should be easy. Letting the struggling readers go off on their own is hard. Those readers seem to be more dependent and less likely to use strategies to help them. I want to use small group lessons to give my struggling readers more support.( I can us the connect, teach, engage, and link.) . I want to make sure all of my students are moving toward being independent readers. Deb McLeod
With many of my students needing extensive support with phonics skills to help improve their reading, I've had the opportunity to be mentored by a master of scaffolding! I've watched her, in one lesson, go from extensive explanations to phrases, to words, and then non-verbal prompts to help a child decode an unfamiliar word. Because of her mentoring, I feel I am good at scaffolding strategies for decoding. I also feel comfortable with my ability to use lean prompts to help a child develop fluency. I always have a pencil following the text the reader is reading aloud, and I use it to tap, slide, or somehow motion what I want the reader to do or notice to support them with becoming a fluent reader. However, when it comes to other reading strategies, I find myself repeating the same lengthy explanation. I therefore provide too much support and need to work on making my language leaner, as Erin said. The chart on 118 gave me a clear picture of how I can scaffold language to support other reading strategies. It has provoked some self-reflection on the language I use, and I will be more aware of it as I teach this fall. ~Stephanie Benedict
I like being able to see and use the leaner prompts on page 118. I generally pare down my prompt on all subjects but I can feel guilt about that. Why? Not teaching enough? So it is so nice to have in black and white permission. Plus several ideas about how to accomplish this task and find success. The mini lesson tie also a teacher could scaffold student by giving a lean prompt dismiss those that are ready, give another meatier prompt to the group then dismiss another group and finally give a very supportive prompt to those that still need assistance.KDN
In addition to the questions and thoughts above, here is a place to post our other ideas and burning questions from chapter four, if any...
After reading this chapter, which really got me thinking of the release support. I tend to over-do the support. I especially liked the key ideas about coaching on page 108 combined with the gradual release of responsibity chart on page 118. I really need to study the leanes less supportive prompts because as I said I tend to give too much support which is probably delaying the students becoming independent which of course is my goal. I plan to make a copy of the strategies on page 118 and keep in with me as I confer and work with small groups to help me decide on a level of support needed. --Jodee Tuttle
I am very similar to Jodee in the area of over-doing support. In working with at-risk students, I find that they have tendencies to depend too much on the teacher. Some have also developed what some authors refer to as "self-helplessness". I find, like Jodee, I really have to monitor my teaching to make sure that I am going through that gradual release of responsiblity during my lessons. I think her idea of having the strategies on page 118 with me during my lessons will help support me with that challenge. Thanks for the great idea, Jodee! ~ Stephanie Benedict